The Royal Library of Alexandria (SP Book Discussion)

I don’t think it’s arbitrary at all. It all has to do with how it’s deployed. In both AGoT and in Alan Moore’s oeuvre, it’s used as a “look how real and edgy my world is and my villains are SO despicable!” As was stated earlier, Moore has been doing this kind of thing for decades…he didn’t just trot this out for Providence (the whole storyline has two violent rapes, at least).

Rape is also triggering for many people, so a lot of thought has to go into its use in fiction. Yes, sexual assault may be unfortunately more common than we’d like to believe, but that doesn’t mean it should be included at whim.

Ultimately, I think what Moore’s making Lovecraft’s sexual paranoia overt is interesting, but I cannot get past the fact that this seems to be Moore’s “thing”, whatever world he’s creating. I think there are more nuanced ways to depict the “nameless rites” Lovecraft refers to, especially since I get the feeling that Moore is trying to titillate as well as horrify.

This is kind of where I was going with the question I asked about the sense of horror in Lovecraft. Moore is aiming for inducing horror too (ostensibly), and he weaves in sex and sexual assault very commonly in his work; Lovecraft was also going for horror obviously, and he avoids anything sexual. Which is more effective?

For me, Lovecraft is more effective, and it may be due (at least in part) to his avoiding sexual content, and certainly avoiding using sex in his writing as a way to convey “this is horrific/this person is horrific”. I have sometimes felt with Moore that he too easily trades horror for degradation. The idea of “violation” is prevalent is both their work, but with Lovecraft it is not a sexual one, it is a violation of the mind or psyche that cannot be undone or erased.

To refer to a classic example where sex could have easily been used to somehow magnify the horror of the situation, Poe does not go into incest in Fall of the House of Usher (though it is alluded to in cinema treatments), though he very easily could have. The horror in the story (IMO) is more effective without this being a focal point–instead, Roderick’s increasing insanity is the focus, putting the narrator in danger and suggesting that the House itself is evil (a very Lovecraftian thing to do).

At the same time, I know how often people attribute Lovecraft’s avoidance of sexual content to who he was as a person, and I don’t want to reflexively do the reverse to Moore and assign his seeming interest in including rape in his work as some indication of his nature as a person/creator. It’s hard to keep from doing so, though, when it feels at times so unnecessary and almost as though it is being included so as to satisfy what might be an audience’s expectation from his work at this point.

Would Providence still be horrific without the scene @OhBollox referenced? Certainly. By including it, does Moore somehow make the horror more believable because it crosses a cultural boundary? I’m not sure.

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Anybody read the Peter Ash series by Nick Petrie?

I did a recommendation post on it here.

Not a full review. Just a recommendation.

Lovecraft also had to contend with very strict censorship. I don’t think it’s accurate or fair to accuse Moore of anything, even titillation (I find his scenes of sexual assault to be about as titillating as the rape scene in Irreversible, which no-one bar perhaps actual rapists find titillating), merely because he includes something other writers intentionally exclude.

An informal history of liquid rocket propellants might not seem like fun, but it is.

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There’s a reason other writers intentionally exclude rape and sexual assault scenes, something Moore definitely leans into (shall we make a list?). GRRM doesn’t exclude them, and I never found they helped his stories in the slightest.

We’ll have to disagree about Burrows’ depiction of Elspeth Wade as well. She’s meant to look precocious, mysterious, and attractive.

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Yes, generally a very deep-seated sense of shame, and often misogyny, that means sex crimes are beyond the pale, and should not be spoken about, never mind depicted. The existence of an arbitrary double standard does not mean it’s automatically correct, merely that some puritanical hypocrisy has been adopted.

The Kingdoms, Pulley. An amnesiac finds himself in a French-dominated Britain, post-Napoleonic invasion. He remembers fragments of his past, and receives a postcard from decades ago, asking him to return home. Vividly written, if a little intentionally vague at times, and fairly slow-paced.

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Apollo by Charles Murray and Catherine Bly Cox. This book explores the beginning of the U.S. space program from the formation of NASA through the end of the Apollo missions. The book tells the stories of mainly the scientists, engineers, flight controllers, and administrators instead of the astronauts. Great book that digs into the stories of those who designed and built the rockets, spacecraft and launch facilities; and explored the science and logistics of sending men into space and to the moon and returning them home safely.

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Path dependency, hysteresis, and short-term political decisions leading to long-term unforeseen outcomes are the broad strokes, and Weldon draws extensively on the Bank of England’s dataset, and the Office of National Statistics, rather than rely on other, more political sources. The picture of not so much crisis management as crisis delayment emerges, and while I think Weldon could easily get a book out of just the post-2000 economic events, he’s serious about the origins of the economic state of play being buried firmly in Britain’s past, more in the sense of a foundation than a grave, and so the later chapters seem to suffer from brevity, given the frequency of incidents we have encountered. Not a long book, just over 300 pages, and quite readable.

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I love this phrase. It does seem like stuff’s been happening a lot recently.

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Doing my best to adhere to the British tradition of understatement.


So. I don’t mind Holland, as far as pop history goes he’s fine, but when I saw this I sucked my teeth. An attempt to explore the primacy of Christianity in the West, and the way it has come to influence vast swathes of culture, even of those not participating in it. I appreciate the points made, though I feel there is somewhat too broad a brush being used. I’m enjoying it because Holland is no evangelist, but there are also quibbles stacking up with each page. Trying to present Christianity as a monoculture even ignoring the Eastern Orthodox churches is incorrect, and I believe there’s far more to Christianity than one monolithic block of belief; nor do I think cultures necessarily were supplanted or replaced by Christianity entirely. It came to be dominant, but I question a lot of the assumptions the work is based on. Obviously he hasn’t presented them himself, yet. Judgement reserved. Ably written and entertaining though, very smooth.

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Memoirs from the front line are relatively rare, and from the lower ranks even more so. What follows is a matter of fact account of a military expedition that while obviously disastrous, often gets swept aside in the face of Napoleonic glory.

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I fucking love books about realistic space exploration, me. I love them. I will forgive many sins in order to enjoy some delta-v and complex maffs I barely understand. It’s a shame then that the likes of Landau’s Oceanworlds insists upon spiting me with dialogue like this, regarding the concept of the Great Filter, coming from a scientist.


No, bro. Come on. Give me something to hang on to. Don’t do me like this man. Science is supposed to lead us away from overweening arrogance, dude. Please.


A great writer, dunking you head-first in their fantasy world. I disappeared into this.

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A few years ago I picked up Declare by Tim Powers based on some discussion here. I enjoyed the book and am again in the mood for something similar that maybe mixes history and cultures with a bit of the supernatural or unexplained. Are any of his other books worth picking up?

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Yup. Virtually all of them are excellent. Anubis Gates is superb and contains what might be literature’s best werewolf. On Stranger Tides is great. Last Call/Expiration Date/Earthquake Weather is a solid trilogy if you want a longer read.

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Thanks! Anubis Gate seems to be the most well-known and I was kind of leaning towards it.

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Thank you for the Blacktongue Thief rec. That was delightful!

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Welcome. Between Two Fires is even better.

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Better than average space opera, still a little too soft-edged for me, but it does have some realistic elements. Some characters are good, some are an attempt at larger-than-life and do not work at all. Some really good prose, competent style, a little too much Whedonism in certain scenes.

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